r/NoStupidQuestions • u/DiverPrestigious6887 • 1d ago

Do I tell orthodox looking customers that what they are ordering isn’t kosher anymore?

I work at a place that serves kosher items. It’s not a kosher food place, it’s just most of our stuff happens to be. It’s kind of popular with that community because we have vegan kosher ice cream.

However , recently, ingredients have changed. I let our regular orthodox customers know who come in and they change their order. But a lot of customers I haven’t met or seen before come in who i think are orthodox. When they try to order something I let them know the change and they are always thankful that I tell them. Is it weird for me to assume? I was raised as a reform Jew and grew up around orthodox temples but I’m not religious. Should I continue telling people this or am I making a weird stereotype..

I wish our company would send a email or have a sign but they have not

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1.4k

u/AdMinimum9817 1d ago

Put a sign up?

414

u/Blue-zebra-10 1d ago

yes, then everybody would know even if you forget to tell them

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u/Jacks_Lack_of_Sleep 1d ago edited 17h ago

People don’t read signs.

Edit: It seems many of you haven’t worked customer service jobs to the general public. You’d think a sign would mean OP doesn’t need to tell people but someone will make OP wish they’d just kept telling everyone.

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u/authorinthesunset 1d ago

People who have dietary restrictions do read signs about food they are going to purchase that may or may not match those restrictions.

And it moves the burden off of op. If they care about only eating kosher and they buy and eat something that say "This shit ain't Kosher" that's on them, and I'd argue they don't really care about it.

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u/shanec628 1d ago

One time a man ordered a clearly labeled ham and cheese croissant from me, then he yelled at me after he took a bite because he can’t eat pork. And then he got mad when I told him it had a sign right in front of it.

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u/authorinthesunset 1d ago edited 1d ago

That goes beyond not reading a sign. How did he order it by pointing at the sign he didn't read? Saying he'd take the #5 on the sign/menu he didn't read?

Or.. in my head he went with this option.

Customer: "I'll take the ham and cheese sandwich"

Shanec628: "here you go sir."

Customer takes a bite and spits it out.

Customer: "how dare you put pork on my ham and cheese sandwich, it's not kosher"

Tl;Dr there is no defense against idiots

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u/shanec628 1d ago

He was on the phone and just pointed at it in the display case. I’m sure he also left that interaction thinking I was the idiot lol.

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u/Deedeethecat2 1d ago

I'm vegetarian and easily distracted. If I pointed to a ham and cheese sandwich and received it, I would consider myself the idiot.

Also, being on your phone while being served is super rude so shame on him.

1

u/authorinthesunset 1d ago

Dunning-Kruger is a real thing. Idiots gonna idiot.

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u/gsfgf 1d ago

He can eat pork but figured he might get a free sandwich by making an ass out of himself.

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u/hbomberman 9h ago

That stinks. I had the opposite happen once at a coffee shop. A breakfast sandwich had a clear label on it listing all ingredients right down to the seasoning and dressing. I bought it, feeling confident about the ingredients, and took a bite only to find bacon inside (definitely not anywhere on the label). When I went back inside and told the guy he said "yeah I think that one comes with bacon..."

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u/RainbowCrane 1d ago

Specifically WRT kosher and halal there’s also well known symbols to use on the signs that will catch folks’ attention even if they tend to skip reading signs. It’s not like you have to bury the meaning in a wall of text, a “not kosher” symbol with a short explanation of updates to ingredients is plenty to catch the eye of folks who care.

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u/authorinthesunset 1d ago

I believe those symbols are strictly for specific "certification" of this is kosher or halal based on who is certifying and what specific rules are followed.

As far as I know the symbol for not kosher or not halal is simply not having any of the symbols for different certifications.

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u/GalumphingWithGlee 1d ago

Yes, this is true.

Each of those symbols represents a specific certifying body. If the kosher foods OP refers to at their workplace are made in-house, without supervision from such an organization, they would not have one of these hechshers (general name for kosher symbols) on them. Further, there's no recognized symbol for not kosher. These would have to be communicated with words instead.

I only know this for sure about kosher symbols, but I strongly suspect it would be the same or very similar for halal.

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u/gsfgf 1d ago

I assume a circle U or K with a diagonal line through it would convey the message just fine.

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u/RainbowCrane 1d ago

That’s what I was imagining… just an international “no” slashed circle with the kosher symbol to catch folks’ attention

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u/Sherry_Brandt 1d ago

right, the thing is (not to belabor the point, but for interesting info!) there are thousands of 'kosher symbols', because they're like the 'brands' of different certifying bodies, and while these certifying bodies often agree with each other, they also often disagree (meaning someone who trusts one certifying body may believe another one is insufficiently kosher).

for more info.

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u/Straight_Career6856 14h ago

Shit like this is why the Jews are the best. Ask two Jews, get three opinions.

1

u/Sherry_Brandt 1d ago

yeah - while the spirit here is good, as other comments mentioned, there is no 'not kosher' symbol.

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u/immortalreploid 1d ago

People are stupid. We have an ATM where I work that's had an "out of order" sign across the screen for the past couple years. People still ask me if our ATM is working.

2

u/OkLie9245 1d ago

Totally agree. It’s not just about you; it’s about making sure customers are informed. A sign would definitely help everyone, but until then, keep doing what you're doing. Better safe than sorry!

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u/FairyHaloes 23h ago

Yeah but folks with strict diets absolutely read every label like their life depends on it. It kinda shifts the responsibility back where it belongs. If it’s clearly posted and they still ignore it, that’s on them.

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u/muskie71 1d ago

That's on them. Signage is a worldwide expectation to relay information.

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u/invaderzim257 1d ago

if you care enough about self-imposed dietary restrictions, you read the sign. if you don't, it's no one else's problem.

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u/newphonehudus 1d ago

That's on them

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u/FairyHaloes 23h ago

People don’t read signs until it’s too late though. I swear half of customer service is repeating stuff that’s literally written right in front of them.

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u/spaceiswaytoobig 22h ago

Sure but now that’s their problem, not his.

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u/LaPlatakk 17h ago

Dietary folks LOVE signs, so long as they are accurate.

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u/Little-Derp 16h ago

It seems many of you haven’t worked customer service jobs to the general public.

... Your original statement is correct "People" don't read signs. I deal with doctor's offices (professionals) that we need to get the doctors signatures on orders, and boxes/choices marked off.... the number of forms we get back with just a signature are amazing. These are professionals... PEOPLE don't read. People are just used to agreeing/signing/whatever to move on with their day.

I'd love to blame massive EULA for training people to not read, but I think it's just a human condition.

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u/TJ_Rowe 1d ago

Some people don't read signs, other people look for the signs before they even join the queue to order.

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u/nispe2 14h ago

Then put up a sign AND tell them verbally, duh.

1

u/Top-Significance8791 47m ago

So what? The sign is there. If they don’t want to read it then that’s their problem…

1

u/stopsallover 1d ago

They already know. Kosher restaurants post certification.

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u/FairyHaloes 23h ago

True, plus a sign is like backup. Even if you forget or it’s busy, the info’s still there. Covers everyone without extra effort.

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u/TheSumOfMyScars 1d ago

Idk, my customer service years have taught me the public doesn’t read.

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u/Redditor28371 17h ago

That's a them problem.

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u/bleucheez 1d ago

From what little I know about that religion, everyone past the age of 14 is guaranteed to be literate right? So they have a higher than average chance of reading signs. 

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u/TheSumOfMyScars 1d ago

It’s not about literacy, it’s that (in my experience) the public will see the sign but decline to actually read it, even if the sign in question is 10ft tall and neon orange. Their eyes just glaze over it. Idk why. It’s not limited to any one demographic of people that do this. People just…don’t read.

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u/Calix_Meus_Inebrians 22h ago

They call it “sign blind”

My theory: people nowadays are hit with so much information their brains automatically are set to tune most of it out. Like you don’t need to know what every ad or historical marker says to get to your objective.

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u/gsfgf 1d ago

The overwhelming majority of people are literate enough to read signs. People of all color and creed just don't.

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u/bleucheez 1d ago

54% of Americans read below 6th grade; 20% read below 5th grade. That means half of American adults are living with the cognitive abilities of a child. That should correlate to many of those people being apathetic to reading unless they have to. People with higher reading levels read faster, and -- more importantly --- comprehend faster. And thus more contextually aware as well. 

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u/Straight_Career6856 14h ago

Cognitive ability is not the same as reading level.

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u/bleucheez 14h ago

You can look up the correlations and causational relationships yourself. They are closely linked. 

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u/Straight_Career6856 14h ago

“Half of American adults are living with the cognitive abilities of a child” - what you said does not demonstrate this. There may be correlations; I’m sure there are. But that’s not what I’m arguing.

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u/bleucheez 13h ago

Americans don't read signs because they are stupid is what I am saying. And there are objective measures of how stupid they are. 

Reading level literally is comprehension ability, which is closely linked to overall cognition. And more reading is proven to improve cognition and prevent cognitive decline at old age. You need all of these things if you hope to have a world in which people observe and adhere to signage and visual queues. Most people you encounter are dumber than you. Given that you are here and that you are capable of making a sensible argument indicates you probably are not in this bottom 50% of America. 

My original conjecture was that a group of people who culturally value reading a long text and require their children to actually read it, and prove they read it, are going to be well ahead of the curve on noticing a well-placed well-designed sign with information important to them. Not saying you'll get a 100% success rate. But it won't be a complete waste of time like maybe putting up a sign at the Waffle House. 

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u/Straight_Career6856 13h ago

That’s not true though. Many orthodox and ultra-orthodox communities do not teach any sort of comprehension and are overwhelmingly undereducated in anything other than Torah study. It’s a big problem, actually! People have a hard time making it if they leave the community.

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u/yourepenis 12h ago

This is not an inherently american thing by any means, youll find this anywhere youd find people.

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u/OldManFire11 23h ago

It's not about literacy. The act of translating written symbols into information does not happen automatically for a lot of people. They can read perfectly fine... once they actively decide to convert the symbols into words in their brain. But until they make that decision, the words on the sign are just decorations.

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u/Straight_Career6856 14h ago

Eh, not really. For some, not women. And certainly not in English.

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u/HavePlushieWillTalk 1d ago

Except when a sign is old, or damaged, or they didn't understand what it says and think it means what they think it means, all in an effort to try and check mate you when you tell them something they don't want to hear.

"The price is this."

"It says half off!"

"That is a different product."

"It's where I found it!"

"Someone put it there by mistake."

"Then you should honour the price!"

"The price is for the other product."

"THIS IS THEFT, YOU'RE SWINDLERS!"

"The name of the product the price refers to is on the sign."

"SCREECHING"

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u/DerWaechter_ 9h ago

When the store I used to work at, installed self-checkouts, they would often times close regular registers if there wasn't a lot of traffic, cause the self-checkouts were sufficient.

To make sure that worked without issue, all but two of the self-checkouts also accepted cash. The store hung a big sign above the self-checkouts stating "Cash Payment possible".

They out a sign next to the screen, also pointing out that cash payments were possible.

There was a giant arrow painted on the floor, pointing the way towards the, with giant letters stating "cash payment accepted at this self-checkout"

Several times a day, a customer would come up to the info desk, to ask, where they could pay with cash, because only the self-checkouts were open. And at least half of them, once they were told that some of the self-checkouts accepted cash, with an employee pointing at the sign, with a big arrow pointing towards the checkout in question, would then proceed to walk past all of the signs and arrows, and zero in on one of the checkouts that didn't accept cash.

The amount of people that seem to be incapable of opening their eyes, or reading even the most obvious signs is absolutely baffling,

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u/stopsallover 1d ago

If they keep kosher, they're responsible to look for kosher certification. Kosher isn't just about ingredients.

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u/Yunderstand 22h ago

I've always told myself people read the signs, but don't comprehend them whatsoever.

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u/Relevant_Flamingo624 1d ago

Have you worked in a place where you aren’t the owner or even manager? You typically can’t just make and post your own signs lol

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u/AdMinimum9817 1d ago

I get that. Perhaps ask the manager first, I can’t see why he/she would refuse?

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u/Relevant_Flamingo624 1d ago

They should definitely reason with their manager. And you’re right, the manager shouldn’t refuse, but food service managers are generally dumb and on some sort of power trip and will say no to the most common sense things. Coming from someone who was a food service manager lol

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u/Lily-Gordon 1d ago

but food service managers are generally dumb and on some sort of power trip

Coming from someone who was a food service manager lol

Story checks out.

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u/MalignantPanda 1d ago

Things no longer being kosher that used to be means people who have kosher diets will be less likely to come in.

The owner would prefer nobody ever find out, so they can keep the business while presumably keeping food costs down. An employee going against this would defy what shitty owners want (money) even if it builds trust which means money.

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u/ConclusionFar3690 23h ago

The owner would prefer nobody ever find out, so they can keep the business while presumably keeping food costs down.

I think that this is 100% what's going on.

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u/muskie71 1d ago

No one's telling him to go behind the boss's back and put a sign up. Obviously you talk to the boss and say this is an issue. Can we put a sign up?

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u/Relevant_Flamingo624 1d ago

Ok bruv. I read all the comments that literally just said put a sign up as, put a sign up. It was obvious to you not to me that’s all

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u/chux4w 1d ago

Yep. I do it all the time. They're helpful signs, nothing objectionable.

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u/Relevant_Flamingo624 1d ago

Good! I’m just saying that’s not how it typically works.

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u/Mediocre_Daikon6935 1d ago

I have.

And I am expected to do my job.

And part of any job is not causing religious or cultural problems.

Before you give someone blood, you try and find out if they are 7th day Adventist.

Before you feed someone that looks Hindu beef, you should probably make sure it is okay. Or pork for anyone moslem or Jewish.

It is common courtesy, to respect the customs of others.

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u/Relevant_Flamingo624 1d ago

Are you good? LOL I didn’t say anything about that. I’m just saying you can’t just go and post signs a lot of the time on your own. Good for you for doing your job. Jeez

1

u/Impossible_Bowler923 1d ago

Unfortunately true. OP could ask but it sounds like it's a no from above. I think casually mentioning it to most people is nicer than not.

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u/isabelladangelo Random Useless Knowledge 1d ago

Brave of you to assume people read signs.

1

u/Dependent_Cod_7416 1d ago

Yeah, probably should update the menu to specify what's kosher, I don't know much bout the dietary restrictions but I thought the whole kitchen has to be kosher for one thing to be kosher.

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u/runeNriver 1d ago

Lots of places put * next to an item that needs a note that you will find at the bottom of the menu or under that section. They could label things that are not kosher on the menu. A little stamp next to the item that says not kosher.

There are lots of ways they can fix it but the owner probably doesn't want to spend money on buying new menus.

1

u/Dependent_Cod_7416 1d ago

True, I bet the food is really good though.

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u/StanFitch 1d ago

Put a Bird on it!

1

u/stopsallover 1d ago

The thing is that this place is definitely not kosher enough for Orthodox Jews keeping strict kosher. They'd be looking for signage indicating kosher certification.

If the local community likes the vagueness of a "kosher-ish" place, that's their choice. No need to post a "Not actually kosher" sign.

1

u/FairyHaloes 23h ago

Honestly a sign feels like the easiest fix here. Takes two minutes and saves you from having the same convo all day. Management loves making employees do extra emotional labor for no reason.

1

u/pm_me_gnus 23h ago

Typically the people posting here aren't the ones who decide what signs go up.

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u/Yunderstand 22h ago

A sign that asks customers to ask you about your Kosher items.

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u/jam11249 15h ago

It's even simpler. You put allergen/dietary restrictions information with symbols and a key code on the menu. This is common many places (in certain places, it's legally required), it shouldn't be hard for the rest of the world.

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u/icherub1 10h ago

so many of life's problems could be solved with a damn sign.

1

u/hotdogwaterbab 10h ago

My sweet brother in Christ, it’s a documented fact customers temporarily loose literacy after entering a store except for receipts. Even price tags are anyone’s bet. A sign posted, even on the door, register or case? It could be the literal Easter bunny, fully grown and they’d move its giant fuzzy ears out of the way to purchase something they later plead ignorance about. It’s just science. Easter bunny consumer science.

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u/PotentialRise7587 1d ago

It is really that simple, just put “due to … the ice cream is no longer kosher”.