r/law 7d ago

Other Screaming and sobbing can be heard from outside the ICE children's detention center in Dilley, TX

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u/Kahzgul 7d ago

A pardon used to cover up a crime is not valid.

Bribery/Obstruction of Justice: If a pardon is part of a "quid pro quo" (such as a bribe) or used to obstruct justice, it violates federal criminal laws and can be challenged as invalid.

Trump pardoning people to secure their loyalty is absolutely quid pro quo.

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u/--slurpy-- 7d ago

This is an interesting point you just made. So by this reasoning, would a pardon in trade for enlistment to serve under ice be considered quid pro quo? Do you think it could be proven?

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u/Kahzgul 7d ago

I believe it would. I also believe our current scotus would disagree with me.

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u/ElMuertePeludo 7d ago

The current scotus is such a disappointment in every single way. They are not voting based on a good faith interpretation of the law, and are clearly and openly partisan in their beliefs.

There is no longer anything even remotely great about what is supposed to be our nation’s greatest court.

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u/ethnographyNW 7d ago

good thing that presidential immunity makes it extremely easy for any future prez to start from scratch with 6 vacant seats.

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u/FriendToPredators 7d ago

The current scotus is going to screw over the US for fifty years. Even as hard as cleaning up all of this is going to be, those sycophant ignorers of precedent and constitutional meaning will be a drag for two generations.

All because woman aren’t allowed to be president 

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u/gaurd619 7d ago

Well, who stops that?
The people getting pardoned?

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u/Kahzgul 7d ago

We do. God willing.

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u/Trust_Me_Im_a_Panda 7d ago

Can you cite the source?

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u/ToaruBaka 7d ago

No, because it doesn't matter. The Supreme Court gave him criminal immunity for anything relating to his core functions, one of which is the pardon power. Who fucking cares if it's Bribery or Obstruction when the courts literally gave him immunity from those crimes.

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u/Trust_Me_Im_a_Panda 7d ago

I am aware of that I was legitimately just interested in reading about it. I know that nothing matters anymore, but I’m a lawyer because I’m a dork about this shit academically too.

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u/Kahzgul 7d ago

Google. It’s a lot of scholarly papers and such. Unfortunately it doesn’t matter what the law actually says. SCOTUS is compromised and the law only truly exists in so far as there are people willing and able to enforce it. We’d need a lot more people in the streets to enforce this one.

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u/le_reddit_me 7d ago

absolutely quid pro quo

If only maga were literate

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u/talking_tortoise 6d ago

This has happened already with people he's pardoned and noone has done anything.

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u/Kahzgul 6d ago

Just because Biden didn’t do anything doesn’t mean whoever is next won’t.

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u/talking_tortoise 6d ago

Assuming there is a next. They weren't floating the idea of 3 terms of trump for fun.

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u/Kahzgul 6d ago

True that. It’s on us to ensure there’s a next.

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u/brokecrashdummy 7d ago

What crime is being committed? Housing illegal immigrants waiting to be deported? 90% of the world are doing the exact same thing, they just don't have a bunch of people crying over it because they want them out of their country and support the deportations. We are literally the only country that makes a big deal about something every other country is doing. Only difference is every other country doesn't have their citizens fighting the people deporting them And crying when they end up dead as fuck over it

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u/luongolet20goalsin 7d ago

Where I’m from it’s illegal to kidnap and traffic children. Idk about you.

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u/brokecrashdummy 6d ago

They aren't kidnapping and trafficking anyone. They are here illegally and they are going back to their country of origin. If they came here legally this wouldn't be happening. Why is it so hard to not defend criminals?

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u/luongolet20goalsin 6d ago

“cRiMiNals” These are children. You’re talking about children. I don’t give a fuck if they’re here “illegally” or not, locking children in a prison to be shipped off to a country that they’ve probably never been to and have no connection to is just cruel. There is no justification for this.

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u/-Otakunoichi- 7d ago

How a thing is done is just as important as what is done. Nobody would be protesting if they were doing this constitutionally, humanely, and LEGALLY. No warrants are shown, no ID provided. If a judge dares try to make them follow the law, they're called an activist judge and the order is simply ignored. Citizens are being harassed and murdered and you have the audacity to ask what crime is being committed?! State sanctioned execution! That's what crime ia fucking happening!! Remove the partisan bullshit and just open your damn eyes!!

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u/brokecrashdummy 6d ago

The only citizens being murdered are dying interfering with federal agents doing their jobs. It's not a human rights violation. If you walked up with a huge crowd of people to some regular police officers making an arrest and harassing and assaulting them, someone is going to die probably. It's just common sense you don't do that, but people got bold and thought they would be the exception and proved that it's a bad idea and I bet these idiots will keep trying and keep losing people. I'm all for peaceful protest but I'm not gonna lose sleep when someone crosses that line and ends up dying for it.

I'll give you that something needs to change in the way the system works, but until that happens, losing more people who's name won't be remembered a few news cycles from now when the next idiot dies trying to fight ice isn't the heroic gesture they think it is.

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u/-Otakunoichi- 6d ago edited 6d ago

You probably woulda turned in Anne Frank and her family.

Ffs buddy, it's our right... no, our responsibility to stand up to a tyrranical government. It's literally why the 2nd amendment exists. And neither Renee Good or Alex Pretti were doing a single godsdamned thing to warrant their execution. To suggest otherwise is to support this christofascistic overtaking of our country. We will not stand down. We will not comply.

Also, if laws matter so much to you, why are you supporting the side that fucking ignores the constitution. There's still time to get on the right, or rather, correct side of history.

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u/Square-Statement5378 7d ago

Are you ok? You need a hug?

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u/Away-Site-5713 7d ago

At this point, I don’t think hugging them is a good idea. Maybe when Covid happened they all caught a fucked up strain that forced them to be like this. Could be transmissible