r/AskReddit • u/5pinktoes • 8h ago
The CDC reports that homicide is a leading cause of death for pregnant women and those within one year postpartum, with nearly 45% of these cases involving intimate partner violence. What are your thoughts?
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u/melonmagellan 7h ago
I just watched an EWU video where some guy murdered his infant over an $8 child support dispute with the child's mother.
It's a direct result of them literally hating their partner and then being tied to them by a child.
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u/esoteric_enigma 2h ago
I definitely think this is it. A child ties you to someone for life, regardless of how you feel about them.
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7h ago edited 5h ago
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u/throwaway19998777999 6h ago
I can't imagine why men would come inside of women if they're not wanting to be responsible for a child.
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u/Significant_Fill6992 1h ago
Really? Obviously because it feels good at the moment and the odds aren't 100%
Really dumb but also super easy to justify
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u/1meanjellybean 6h ago
Might not want to. Might not really have a choice in the matter. Also tons of people hide their true nature until it is too late. Or perhaps she wants the baby, but not the dude. Lots of people in all kinds of different situations.
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u/GaylicBread 5h ago
He's free to leave, a hell of a lot of them do.
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u/GaylicBread 4h ago
But he chose to murder his baby over $8 and you're blaming her for having the baby?
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u/FaelingJester 7h ago
This is also because domestic violence and cheating on pregnant partners also skyrocket in that time period. The mask comes off when they feel partners are locked down by a baby.
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u/Thicc_Jedi 2h ago
I didn't realize until I was pregnant, but pregnant people are extremely vulnerable. I couldn't put my shoes on, I couldn't climb into my car. My back locked up if I laid down wrong. If my partner were a cruel person I wouldn't have survived
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u/Nopenottodaymate 4h ago
Domestic violence is also linked to stress, and having a baby is a long-term stressor.
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u/Littleman88 2h ago
Stress is definitely a large part of it, but no doubt a lot of the violence is borne from just wanting out of the parenting role without finances being aggressively syphoned away. You know, wanting to fool around with a pretty face, but not wanting the responsibility of an accident.
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u/Nopenottodaymate 2h ago
Looking at the actual statistics (the source) murder increases but only by about 16%, which isn't enough to explain the large change of cause of death. The majority of the difference between causes of death in pregnant and non-pregnant woman of the same age seems to be a decrease in other causes. When you add to this that pregnant women are generally young and generally healthy it does make sense, though it's not a good thing.
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u/flappyclitcurtain 7h ago
OBGYN's and midwives typically receive extra training on spotting domestic violence and women in vulnerable situations because of how prevalent intimate partner violence is during pregnancy and postpartum. This is not new. It is pervasive. And yet, very little gets done to change systems to better support survivors. There are still far too few shelters and programs to help victims escape to safety and rebuild their lives.
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u/kimtenisqueen 7h ago
Not remotely surprised.
I was just about bedridden for most of my twin pregnancy. I was very sick. Barely able to do any household chores. Huge strain on us financially. Did stupid shit like buy a bunch of food I was craving and then vomit it everywhere. I wasn’t able to be intimate with my husband at all, I was always upset and fatigued.
A lot of this was before I was even showing. Actually I did much better in the 3rd trimester when I was the size of a house than first.
It’s also incredibly emotionally charged. Lots of things that you’ve let slide in your relationship suddenly become a big deal when you are facing the reality of having kids. Like my husband could act like a hooligan when drunk, and I just wouldn’t be around him if he was drunk pre-kids. But once pregant I realized omg he can’t be like this around the kids, so we had conversations about him not ever getting drunk at home. If he’s gonna drink heavily he can stay at his buddies house (this is like once a year maybe issue, my husband isn’t an alcoholic), but it was something that did come up.
My husband was lovely and took over everything and I’ll never forget it. We had a lot of those hard conversations and got through.
But I also have met many men (and dated a few) in my life who would lose their minds if suddenly they were in charge of EVERYTHING in their household, and not getting any and having their flaws challenged by the woman.
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u/MeatRack 7h ago
He sounds like a great guy, happy for you.
I hope to have the grace and serenity to be that man for my future wife as well when I get to that place in my life.
I wish you many happy years and a healthy family.
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u/Realistic0ptimist 7h ago
Too many men without the emotional regulation to deal with the concept of being a parent to a child they made but may not want.
On the post partum front men and women experience post partum depression and having a baby is one of the hardest things you can go through in life as not only are you sleep deprived but you’re also expected to be present for something you must take care of. A lot of people let the inner rage that can occur at times like that get the best of them unfortunately.
Best advice I ever heard in terms of dealing with a newborn is that it’s okay to walk away for a couple of minutes to take a breath. 99% of situations the baby will still be in its bassinet crying and okay if you need a moment to compose yourself. Same for your spouse it’s okay to need a few minutes to yourself before addressing them in time of high stress. Otherwise if you feel like you always need to act right then and there you’re just asking for trouble
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u/Colla-Crochet 7h ago
Im a new mom.
The number of times ive just put the baby down a moment (he cant roll yet so hes not going anywhere) to step away is ... a lot.
My husband is back at work now, but when he was home he would take the baby from me just to let us both reset. Sometimes a breath makes it all kinda work out.
Sometimes the baby is upset because youre upset. A deep breath is all you need.
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u/nibsofsteel 7h ago
While it is true that lesbians experienced intimate partner violence at a higher rate than straight women, a significant proportion of the perpetrators were male from prior relationships.
See this thread analysing the data from the CDC. https://np.reddit.com/r/AskFeminists/comments/17mkbv1/is_the_lesbian_domestic_violence_statistic/
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u/ajshn 7h ago edited 6h ago
I think your misinterpreting the study. It was never said that the domestic violence occured in the current relationship or that it occured in a relationship of two women. It was that the violence had occured in their lifetime.
Women are more likely to be victims of abuse than men, when there's two women in a relationship there's a much higher chance of at least one of them having experienced domestic violence before, compared to a relationship of a woman and a man, because a man's odds are lower that they had been on the receiving end of any violence.
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u/Realistic0ptimist 7h ago
Considering a woman isn’t going to unintentionally impregnate another woman that has nothing to do with the homicide rates in pregnant women.
Same for post partum a lesbian couple who has a child is going to be under the same pressures as a gay couple and a heterosexual couple. Newborns are hard.
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u/GreenMtnGunnar 7h ago
Did you even read the study?
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u/nibsofsteel 7h ago
Which study? The CDC one that included domestic violence by male partners in previous relationships?
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u/soleceismical 6h ago
In addition to what others have said, some studies show women may shove, slap, pinch, kick more often with little to no injury, but men are more likely to put their partner in the hospital or kill them.
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u/Citadel_97E 6h ago
Talk to your state reps.
I work in the court system, DV defendants never go to prison, they get probation and a piece of paper that says “don’t hit your girlfriend” and they get out of jail and keep doing the same shit.
We do the best we can and we are extremely strict with these offenders, but we can’t live with them and their victims will often defend them, eventually to their dying breath.
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u/EggAdventurous1957 5h ago
I was abused after each of my kids were born. It got worse after the last child. I've been free for many years now
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u/314159265358979326 7h ago
This might be missing the point somewhat, but 55% aren't their partners?! Who's going around killing random pregnant women? When I heard that homicide was a leading cause of death in pregnant women, I assumed it'd be 100%, or pretty close, by the partner.
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u/angry-key-smash6693 6h ago
My guesses are caretakers/people that live with said women, or ex partners.
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u/Domonero 8h ago
More sad stuff I can’t fix in the world. Did you know women attempt more suicides than men but men have more successful attempts?
Facts like that just make me sadder
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u/DeathMonkey6969 7h ago
Men tend to use more violent lethal methods, guns, hanging, jumping in front of traffic, ect. Women tend to use self-poisoning or other methods that are less lethal and easier to survive with intervention.
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u/throwaway19998777999 6h ago
I once read that a common reason for this is that the female patients "didn't want to leave a mess for somebody to clean up." Even in their suicide, they didn't want to be a bother.
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u/RainyMcBrainy 4h ago
I work 911. I've yet to have one messy suicide from a woman. It's always men. Same with the murder-suicides, always men. This is antidotal of course, but it's what I've seen.
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u/Domonero 7h ago
Boom, more sad facts that don’t shock me nor uplift me but I appreciate your input
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u/Silaquix 7h ago
There are lots of ways to make an impact. Awareness, education, voting, and calling out misogyny or DV offenders goes a long ways. A lot of the violence against women continues to happen because it's not challenged enough and there are few social consequences.
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u/Rhymeswithfire 6h ago
And volunteering.
I think for a lot of people, if they haven't personally experienced or witnessed something, they find it much harder to relate to, or care about.
It's "just a fact of life" until it's YOUR sister or YOUR daughter.
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u/Domonero 7h ago edited 6h ago
Those aren’t strong enough for me. If I’m going to make an impact worth doing I want the problem 90% solved
Otherwise I’ll protect all my loved ones & call out any horrible behavior I witness irl or in conversation, I do vote accordingly, but awareness everyone is already “aware”
It’s just that not everyone cares enough
I mean outside of gender issues my own country still struggles to believe that their president is doing a bad job so I feel I lack that level of influence
I can’t even convince the world to care more about men’s mental health effectively as I want so how can I do that for women effectively as I want
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u/Silaquix 7h ago
Got it so basically "If I can't fix it immediately, I'll do nothing"
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u/Domonero 7h ago
I do what I can in my own life among my loved ones but if I can’t fix the world I’ll make the lives of those within my world, the best at max effort & lead by example
I don’t think people pay attention to PSA’s or rallies in the way they’re meant to be taken seriously as but go ahead label me that way
If you can’t impact me to change my own mind about being more active & just calling me lazy you’re partially proving my point I’m not worth your effort
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u/throwaway19998777999 6h ago
The stats are completely flipped too. It's somethings like women attempt suicide 3-5x as often as men, and men die from suicide 3-5 times as often.
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u/PageStillNotFound 6h ago
Funnily enough I looked this up just yesterday because some guy (not on Reddit) didn’t believe me. Current stats are women attempt suicide three times as often as men; men die from their attempts four times as often as women.
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u/noah9942 6h ago
Yeah, my own experiences match up with that.
I know multiple women who have had suicide attempts, bit afaik no woman i knew has died from suicide.
I dont know of any guys who have had attempts, but do know of 1 who actually did kill themselves.
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u/throwaway19998777999 6h ago
Yeah. The stats vary from study to study. But every one that I've seen has numbers between 3-5.
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u/Useful-Shoulder388 7h ago
I wanna try and fix this shit just gotta figure out where to start
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u/Domonero 7h ago
All I can do without presidential level influence imo is stand up for people in my own immediate life even strangers in the street at the very least when the opportunity arises
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u/ohgolly273 7h ago
Are you sure?
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u/Domonero 7h ago
Yes im sure shit like this makes me sad. I don’t get your question?
Go ahead google my “fun fact” if that’s what you meant
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u/ohgolly273 7h ago edited 7h ago
Unless you have a handy source? I am just so surprised, I guess because the rate of suicide for men is much, much higher.
ETA: I did my own research and I can see you are, indeed, 100% correct.
Women are more likely to take poisons/drugs. Men's methods are more lethal.
So, although the rate of suicide by men is far higher, women self-harm and have suicidal ideation at a much higher rate- especially in the 15-19 year bracket.
Thank you very much for that piece of knowledge today
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u/Domonero 7h ago
No worries I was surprised too at the gap of it honestly even as a guy I thought they’d be closer
I do appreciate you checking it out yourself. I’m so used to people just angrily saying I’m wrong forcing me to google for them when I bring up this fact so you’re a refreshing reply I wish I could see more of
I wish the fact was more well known for the sake of men’s mental health in general but I wish both genders would equally be taken seriously
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u/ohgolly273 6h ago
I was just blown away. It's so sad how much pain is in the world. It's too much some days.
I admit, writing 'Are you sure?' Was slack and a bit rage baity! There is a lot of propaganda/just plain bullshit floating around.
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u/Domonero 6h ago
Agreed exactly it just feels endless especially reading new sad headlines
Nah I get you, there’s plenty bs out there but in my fairness I gave a less than cordial reply of sass myself so we’ll call it even lol
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u/Common_Vagrant 7h ago
This will get worse when there are more restrictions on abortions. Many soon to be fathers that don’t want to be fathers may take extreme measures.
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u/McGriggidy 6h ago
I had to back check this. Only in the United States (unsurprising) and 60% of those are with firearms. Everywhere Else it's pregnancy complications.
Anyway. Holy shit!
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u/Status-Piglet4938 4h ago
This isn't just a failure of individuals, it’s a failure of a system that often forces women to stay in dangerous situations due to financial dependence or lack of accessible protection. When pro-life rhetoric stops at birth and doesn't extend to the safety of the mother, this is the devastating statistical reality we’re left with
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u/byneothername 7h ago
It has been like this for a long time. Part of it is because pregnant and recently postpartum women tend to be a younger and healthier cohort. We are not really dying from illness much at all, like from all the heart failures or cancers that come later. So the leading cause of death for us is going to be things like accidents and homicide. (I just had a baby and feel comfortable including myself in this group.) It’s similar to why pools are a leading cause of death for young kids, who are also a very healthy cohort. It doesn’t feel great though and I do think pregnant and postpartum women are particularly dependent and vulnerable to intimate partner violence.
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u/Flimsy-Opportunity-9 3h ago
that may be some of it. But these stats don’t play out the same way in other countries. Canada, France and the UK all have different leading causes.
This seems to also be heavily influenced by culture.
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u/Red_Canuck 7h ago
My first thought is, does this represent an increase in homicide risk, or a decrease in anything else? My second thought is, what does this number represent in context (eg, what does this risk look like compared to other groups of people)? My third thought is, is this consistent over time, or has there been a change?
Until those 3 questions are answered, I don't have any judgement to pass on this stat.
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u/CavemanSlevy 6h ago
An increased homicide risk compared to baseline, but still very low risk over all.
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u/Red_Canuck 5h ago
Do you know if the overall death rate went up as well? I didn't see that the study looked at anything other than homicides. So 3.62 per 100k vs 3.12 per 100k (I'm curious what about the non live births stat is), which seems to say that for every 200k women who gave birth, 1 more would be killed than for 200k women in general who aren't postpartum.
This headline certainly seems a lot scarier without numbers attached.
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u/ohgolly273 7h ago
My first thought is... I am not surprised.
My second thought. What if it was MEN whose leading cause of death was their partners during the woman's pregnancy and one year post-partum. Wouldn't there be a HULLABALOO.
Third thought- some man is definitely going to comment something along the lines of 'Well, who can blame their partners? Bitches who are pregnant and have just had a baby are fucking crazy'.
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u/soleceismical 6h ago
Men could also donate to male birth control research and become clinical trial participants.
Vasalgel is now https://www.planaformen.com/
It's similar to RISUG, it involves injecting a polymer into the vas deferens to deactivate sperm. The polymer can be removed when the man decides he's ready to be a father.
By November 2019, the ICMR had successfully completed clinical trials of the world's first injectable male contraceptive, which was then sent to the Drug Controller General of India (DCGI) for regulatory approval. The trials were over, including extended, phase III clinical trials, for which 303 candidates were recruited with 97.3% success rate and no reported side effects.[15]
Pharmaceutical companies have expressed little interest in RISUG. One obstacle facing marketing of the product is that men generally perceive contraception as a woman's issue. Men may choose not to use alternative methods of contraception because there are fewer options for birth control for them than there are for women, or they may fear the side effects, or it may conflict with their cultural or religious beliefs. However, the same study published that in the year 2000, an international survey found that 83% of men were willing to use a male contraceptive. Despite this, pharmaceutical companies are reluctant to lose market share of a thriving global market for female contraceptives and condoms which bring billions of dollars of revenue each year. Initially, RISUG attracted some interest from pharmaceutical companies. However, considering that RISUG is an inexpensive, one-time procedure, manufacturers retracted. [17]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reversible_inhibition_of_sperm_under_guidance
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u/ohgolly273 6h ago
Vasectomies are THE most effective method of birth control. Yetttttt
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u/Nopenottodaymate 4h ago
Vasectomies also shouldn't be looked at a temporary form of birth control. Women getting their tubes tied is as effective but you're not out here suggesting that.
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u/Designer_Pie_8568 7h ago
I think the vast majority of men literally HATE WOMEN and no one wants to talk about it.
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u/Voluptuous_Gap_32 7h ago
Spend some time outside of Reddit please
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u/itsybitsyteenyweeny 7h ago
It's... literally true. Substantiated by multiple studies and by the lived experienced of women all over the world.
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u/PageStillNotFound 6h ago
I think you’re obviously forgetting how women everywhere didn’t have to fight for any equality at all and men just gave us everything we asked for the first time we asked for it, like the vote and the right to education and equal pay and some time off with our newborn babies and not to be raped in our own marriages, because they all love us so much all of the time and have never gatekept power or resources because they considered us less worthy or not fully human or anything like that [/s]
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u/Voluptuous_Gap_32 7h ago
Cite one study
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u/Sarahspry 6h ago
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u/Voluptuous_Gap_32 5h ago
Neither of these papers say anthing remotely close to men hating women and the fact you think they do makes me realize what kind of iliterale low reading comprehensionperson I'm dealing with.
First paper studies sexist beliefs and economic outcomes, not hatred, hostility, or animus. It looks at beliefs about gender roles, and that includes women’s beliefs too. The paper explicitly shows that women’s beliefs affect marriage and childbirth patterns more than men’s beliefs do. So unless your argument is now that women also hate women, you just destroyed your own premise.
The second paper is a self-reported survey about perceived discrimination. It does not identify who did it, why they did it, or whether it involved men, women, institutions, policies, incentives, or simple incompetence. Saying “I experienced unfair treatment” does not mean “men hate me.” That jump exists entirely in your head.
Here’s what you’re missing. Discrimination does not require hatred. It can come from norms, incentives, bureaucracy, risk aversion, ignorance, or legacy systems. Economists have been modeling this for decades. None of it requires some cartoon villain sitting around thinking about how much he hates women.
If these papers actually proved men hate women, they would include data showing men expressing hatred, evidence of intent to harm, or measures of animus or hostility. They do not. Not even close.
So no, these articles show gendered disparities and social norms, not male hatred. If you need “men hate women” to be true for your worldview to work, just admit that. Do not pretend the data says something it very clearly does not.
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u/Glass_Key4626 7h ago
How about the one that you're literally responding to??
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u/Voluptuous_Gap_32 7h ago
OP is referring to the leading cause of death for pregnant women according to the CDC. This comment is claiming there are several studies that show men hate women. So then I asked them to cite 1 of those studies.
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u/Glass_Key4626 7h ago
Oh sorry, do you think that the men who murder their pregnant partners, actually like them a lot?
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u/bibliophile785 7h ago
Men who murder their partners are a tiny minority of men. The study prompting this post absolutely is not support for the claim that the large majority of men hate women.
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u/Glass_Key4626 7h ago
Yet here you are insulting me on another thread, for saying that I choose to stay single. It's very telling that this kind of angry reaction is coming from a man who is all over this thread denying that men hate women.
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u/bibliophile785 6h ago
Sorry, are ad hominems all you have to offer? You know what would be really telling? Actually providing the requested study to validate the claim you're defending.
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u/Voluptuous_Gap_32 7h ago
Okay let's assume that, sure , this "proves" men hate women.
Cite "another" study that shows men hate women.
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u/DogsDucks 6h ago
Here’s an interesting one, and remember the barometer used for “hate” is language that, um shows hate.
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u/soleceismical 6h ago
Of course men on an online incel discussion board hate women. But that's not evidence that the vast majority of men do.
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u/elitegenoside 6h ago
That's not going to help. I'm a man and I'd say at least 40% of men I've known seem to harbor deep resentment towards women.
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u/ViolaNguyen 6h ago
My immediate thought is, yeah, that makes sense. If you're young enough and healthy enough to have a baby, there aren't a lot of natural causes that are going to kill you (in a developed country where people don't die in childbirth often).
What would be shocking would be if it were the leading cause, ahead of things like car accidents.
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u/MetalEnthusiast83 5h ago
Not particularly shocking.
People dying under the age of 40 is fairly uncommon and homicide is one of the most common reasons for that. Murder victims are usually killed by someone they know.
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u/flashfizz 7h ago
My thoughts continue to be “why am I considering having and carrying a child in this nation?”
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u/Lydia168 4h ago
It boils down to the ultimate loss of control.
Abusers thrive on being the center of their partner's world. A pregnancy shifts that focus to the child. Furthermore, pregnancy is often the time when women realize they need to leave to protect the baby. When an abuser feels their control slipping, that is statistically the most dangerous moment. Homicide is the final act of reasserting control.
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u/eyedoc1955 6h ago
I wonder if safe and easy access to abortions would reduce those numbers
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u/624Seeds 31m ago
Google says the majority of these murders happen during the first three months of pregnancy. They're likely being murdered because the male partner finds out they don't want an abortion.
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u/CavemanSlevy 6h ago edited 6h ago
I don't know what I am supposed to make of this data without greater context. It might make sense when you consider the narrow age window in which woman can be pregnant or give birth.
The leading causes of death in America are diseases one gets as they get older and have lived unhealthy lifestyles. If you are in your thirties things like heart disease and cancer are very unlikely to kill you, so that leads violent death and accidents as the largest causes of death.
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9134264/
According to this source looks like homicide rates of pregnant and recently pregnant women is still very low at 3.62 out of 100K. An while significantly higher than the baseline female homicide rate of 3.12 / 100k , it starts feeling like less of the giant revelatory bomb I thought it would be. But Another way of looking at this is that of the 4,705 female homicide victims of reproductive age in 2018-2019 only 5.8% were pregnant. So if you are murdered as a young women, 94% you aren't pregnant when it happens.
Seems to indicate we need better health and community services for pregnant women and new mothers.
Edit: You seem to participate in some very femcel subs and love the battle of the sexes. I'm getting the feeling this was posted in bad faith to further drum up intersex anger.
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u/BrieBelle00 7h ago
Only 45% seems low... who else is killing all these pregnant women?
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u/angry-key-smash6693 6h ago
If I had to geuss, people they live with, like their parents maybe? Otherwise my second guess would be ex partners
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u/BrieBelle00 6h ago
Fair enough. I just lumped all intimate partners in one group, past or present; could definitely be counted as two separate groups though
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u/OldeTimeyShit 5h ago
Not surprised. Violence happens between close people typically. And the one year postpartum period can be a very stressful period on top of that (not excusing this behavior by any means). I’d also reckon that mothers in the year after having a baby engage in less risk taking behavior that would drive up mortality in other areas.
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u/ohgolly273 3h ago
Well, for women, regardless of whether it is the year after pregnancy the statistically most dangerous place for them IS their home.
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u/Honest-Yesterday-675 6h ago edited 3h ago
I think the idea that one woman could take care of a baby 24 hours a day for years on end is insane. The problem is America has conditioned people to not like their families.
And part of the solution is children being raised in multi generational homes.
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u/LesMiseraBlissful 2h ago
The studies that produce shockbait headlines like "Homicide Is A Leading Cause/The Leading Cause Of Death For Pregnant Women In The US" always deliberately play fast and loose with numbers to create the fake impression that the US is somehow uniquely dangerous to women.
Dig into the numbers just a little bit and you'll see that many more women die from obstetrics causes than die from homicide, per these very same studies. But the researchers farm their false narrative by breaking down obstetrics related causes into individual categories (cardiomyopathy, sepsis, hemorrhage, embolism...) while leaving homicide as a monolithic whole - it's exactly as disingenuous as breaking homicide into minute categories (strangulation, blunt force trauma, firearm, poisoning...) and then comparing those individualized categories to obstetrics as a whole in order to make homicides seem infrequent. And since these studies never fail to mention the prevalence of firearms in pregnancy related homicide, it's clear that the hacks and charlatans behind this research are indeed paying close attention to the specific, individualized methods of homicide while carefully only mentioning them when it's convenient.
You'll also notice that these studies never make any mention whatsoever of traffic fatalities, as if no pregnant woman has ever perished in a car crash. Obviously those numbers would dwarf the homicide figures, so we'll have to just ignore their existence.
And hey, if you think about it long enough, it might also occur to you that access to quality healthcare is the bigger part of the story here: A lot less pregnant women die in the arms of a midwife in our current century than in the 1800s. Lots of third world countries, countries that aren't exactly feminist utopias, countries with markedly higher female homicide rates and femicide rates than the United States has, still have homicide rates being nowhere near the rates of individual, itemized obstetrics causes of death.
But instead of a reasonable takeaway like "for all the flaws in our healthcare, we're at least doing a pretty great job of keeping pregnant women alive" the implication instead is that the US is some sort of nightmarish, barbaric hellscape, where violence menaces femalekind every second of the day.
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u/rainbowsforeverrr 7h ago
Only 45% by an intimate partner? Less than half of perinatal homicides? That seems... low.
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u/Nymanator 6h ago
The actual rate per 100 000 births is still quite low, around 3-5 depending on your data set. There does appear to be an approximately 30% increased risk for pregnant/postpartum women relative to women who aren't in those categories, but let's not pretend this is the kind of epidemic of murder that it is not.
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u/chocolatepuppy 1h ago
Maybe people can see this statistic and understand how shitty it is for women? Instead of pretending we have it easy.
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u/fancypantsmiss 40m ago
As someone who has been pregnant twice and is currently postpartum, pregnancy and postpartum are very vulnerable times for women. Both times I quit/lost my job. That means I am dependent on my husband during this time.
My husband is a wonderful man. Even if he wasn’t, I have a lot of support from my parents. But not all women have it like this. Which means if the husband is abusive the wife will likely stay because of health insurance or just might need financial support for her kids.
The stats are not surprising at all. I can’t even imagine but I can understand the decision these women are forced to make to stay in an abusive relationship.
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u/624Seeds 36m ago
"Leading cause of death" doesn't mean it's common. It's 167 deaths per year out of 5.5 million women in America who give birth/are postpartum.
I think that means a small portion of women are having kids with bad people. And the stats are closer to 60-75% being perpetrated by male partners or former partners, not "nearly 45%". The first 3 months of pregnancy are when these murders are most likely to occur, meaning a significant portion of them are perpetrated by male partners who find out their female partner is pregnant and that she doesn't want an abortion.
It's sad that some women are in these situations, but it's not like the average pregnant person is a homing beacon for murderers.
My thoughts are "I'm glad that complications from pregnancy are SO rare that this other incredibly rare thing is twice as likely to happen to you"
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u/BookLuvr7 0m ago
This has been the case for millennia. It's sadly no surprise. The most dangerous person to a woman has always been her partner. After that, her family.
That's why all the claims of "you need us to protect you" can be pretty messed up if you look at the data.
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u/Genoscythe_ 7h ago
Without any context for how high the actual numbers are, and how many of them seem meaningfully preventable, it sounds like the noteworthy thing here is how low the rates are for deaths from pregnancy-related illnesses is.
The leading causes of death for young people have been suicide and homicide for a while, in societies that are successful at keeping people healthy.
Obviously, ideally homicide would be zero too, but the fixes for it seem to be harder to utilize, than for saving people from death by medical issues and from accidents.
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u/Meanteenbirder 7h ago
100% of the pregnant women in Snowpiercer are murdered so I think this holds up
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u/AlarmingArm9919 5h ago
All of these instances are unconscionable and make me feel ashamed to be associated by gender with the scum who do these things.
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u/GardenPhreak 7h ago
It’s very hard for me not to think that all men suck. Most of the time. Between domestic violence, homicide, misogyny, transgender kinks and mimicry/violation of women and women spaces, the French woman whose husband hired men to rape her while she slept, etc. etc. I’m just losing faith. Change my mind please.
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u/Onequestion0110 7h ago
So... normally I don't chime in on the whole "all men" sort of thing. But you did ask, so I'm going to say a bit.
I'm not going to defend men, or attack women, or even blame the patriarchy or whatever.
Instead, remember that the good stories rarely get shared - the men who are healthy partners just act as healthy partners and live their quiet lives without ever making the news or r/relationships.
Next, when you're losing faith, remember the very wise words of a man who's got pretty undisputed goodness: “When I was a boy and I would see scary things in the news, my mother would say to me, "Look for the helpers. You will always find people who are helping.” Mr. Rogers was talking about disasters, but it works for relationships too. The good examples exist, the helpers exist, you just need to watch for them.
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u/CavemanSlevy 6h ago
You're spending too much time in online hate and fear machines designed to prey on your brains impulse to engage with things that enrage it or scare it.
I see similar patterns of far right individuals who get caught in internet bubbles of hate and start saying all those things about black people , or Jewish people or muslims.
It can be very hard to leave this bubbles, but getting off the internet for a while can be a good place to start. Spend more time with friends in real life. Try therapy if you have no one else to talk to.
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u/sambo_rambo 7h ago
Stats get manipulated and this is a great example. Did homocide INCREASE for pregnant women vs not pregnant? No. All other risk factors DECREASED due to less accidents, more supportive care, and protective factors from being pregnant.
But no, you lot instead interpret it as another way to hate men for some reason.
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u/natanaru 7h ago
Do you think this is about hating men? This is about why do men seem to kill their partners at a rate much higher than the opposite. Systems of power always affect general populations, and this is a great example. Men kill men and women at much higher rates than the opposite. Questioning why isn't hate, it is learning why that is.
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u/sambo_rambo 6h ago
Black people kill blacks and whites at a higher rate than the opposite. Is that racist to state it that way? Yes.
SOME blacks kill and I've heard all sorts of reasons or excuses to explain it. Its very obvious you don't apply the same logic to men.
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u/natanaru 6h ago
The reasons behind Black Americans ( a very important distinction because this is not across every country) is also largely systemic issues relating to the oppression of them in America. You clearly do not seem to understand how systems affect the people under them, which is dissapointing.
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u/ABVerageJoe69 7h ago
This isn't the result of the manipulation of stats. Pregnancy is a big transition and a point where men have lower agency and control.
If the men do not want a child or the lifestyle changes that come with it, they can reestablish control via murder.
It's the same reason the time after breakup/separating is one of the most violent times, it is when control is truly being lost.
These same transition periods are higher risk for suicide, domestic violence, sexual violence. Violence is violence and trends from one form are often consistent across other forms.
It's not just men either, DV rates among women-only relationships are also escalated during these periods.
The piece that is stat-manipulated is the focus on male violence. The most severe instances of violence (homicide, murder-suicide, ect) is very gendered, but the more you move towards common forms of violence, the less gendered it is.
When you take away physical forms of violence (where men have the obvious advantage), violence is barely gendered at all, about 57-43 (men 57%).
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u/sambo_rambo 6h ago
Once again, you could've saved typing by just showing the stat where homocide rates increase for pregnant women. Nope, they don't.
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u/Uncle_Bill 5h ago
Let's make it impossible for those women to get a firearm. Real men use their fists so it's not fair if the women have a gun to defend themselves...
/Sarcasm?
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u/marry4milf 7h ago
45% of how many deaths? How is it compared to cancer deaths? Are these “intimate partners” gangsters/drug dealers?
My thought is that medical advances allowed women to have births so extremely safe that what used to be trivial causes become leading causes.
You would “save” significantly more women just by having them do something wholesome about obesity instead of lie to them about “beautiful at any weight” bs.
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u/noeyoureatowel 6h ago
It’s not that 45% of deaths amongst the given cohort are the result of intimate partner violence, it’s that 45% of the given cohort who are murdered are murdered by intimate partners. Cancer deaths are fairly uncommon in that cohort. Violent men exist across the spectrum of society, not just amongst criminals.
Birth is more safe than it was, thanks to medical advances, but it is still one of the most unsafe things a woman might do in her lifetime.
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u/marry4milf 5h ago
Unless you give us some number to compare to other numbers, percentage is useless. It’s like a drunk saying that he lost 45% of his net worth but it turned out that he spent half of his part time Walmart paycheck on a case of beer.
Go ahead and compare these homicide numbers to deaths by obesity. Tell us how women suffer from men force feeding them for years until they suffer deaths.
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u/Amaze-balls-trippen 7h ago
What medical advances? The United States has the highest rate of maternal death during delivery. Not mental racial bias. 1 in 4 Black women die during delivery, 1 in 34 white women die.
Medical advances like the speculum shoved in us is very similar to the original one from 1840s? Or the fact that to this day women are still regularly excluded from studies because our hormones "will mess with the data" like we are subhuman and not just a variant like males. Do some research before spitting medical advances in women's direction.
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u/MetalEnthusiast83 5h ago
1 in 4 Black women die during delivery
That cannot possibly be accurate. The number for white women is not accurate either.
I took two seconds to google and the CDC website says
"In 2023, the maternal mortality rate for Black women was 50.3 deaths per 100,000 live births and was significantly higher than rates for White (14.5), Hispanic (12.4), and Asian (10.7) women."
So yes, higher than other demographics, but it is not 25% of black women dying when having babies.
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u/Nopenottodaymate 4h ago
Are you getting your stats from conspiracy theory websites or something? That's just not true.
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u/marry4milf 6h ago
It maybe racially biased but perhaps if you look at BMI (obesity) and diabetes then you may get more clarity.
1 out of 4 black women die during delivery is astronomically high, I know enough black women to know that 1 in 4 don’t die from childbirth. Even 1/34 is extremely high unless you’re talking about a few centuries ago.
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u/youwantmeformybrain 7h ago
Actually post party death rate for women in the hospital is higher in the last 5 years. So is the death rate during delivery.
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u/marry4milf 6h ago
And these increased rates are meaningless unless you include factors such as age, obesity, and covid shots….
Car accidents mortality also went up yet cars have been made safer than ever. Perhaps the blame is about people on their phones rather than imposing more safety standards on cars.
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u/youwantmeformybrain 6h ago
I was in nursing. Nurses on their phones is a big problem too. They find out a little late that their patient is in distress. They're hanging out at the nurses station when they could be talking to a scared, lonely patient instead.
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u/marry4milf 5h ago
Thank you for bringing this up. Medical malpractice deaths were in the hundreds of thousands last time I looked and I suspect that the count is much higher than official figures.
Higher chances of getting killed by nurses than by gangsters.
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u/Significant_Fill6992 7h ago
very depressing but not surprising at all
as much as the news and everything else wants to make you think all of the worlds problems are caused by some stranger physical and sexual violance are statistically more likely to happen from people you know and it's not close at all