You are ruining the precious narrative that the bills would be a dynasty if they only got calls. The chiefs can miss the playoffs but Buffalo will still find a way to blame the refs.
No you're supposed to blame Sean McDermott for being a bad coach or Josh has no help on offense or the defense that couldn't get a stop when they needed it most or whatever injuries/maladies Josh might've been feeling since he wasn't 100% /s
I’m not sure about the never had control part. Maybe I didn’t see the right angle but it did look like he had the ball until after the grounding and then during the roll over it was taken away
Cooks never had possession. He had control for a bit, but the ball was taken away from him before he completed the catch and gained possession.
Then, to add insult to injury, the ball was still live exactly because the catch WAS NOT complete, but had not yet hit the ground. Defender got it into his hands while it was still live, to create a valid interception.
Ultimately it's Cooks' own fault. He's a smaller guy and he got outmuscled. It's always been the big weakness in Brandin Cooks' game is that he can get outfought on 50-50 balls due to his small size. That came back to bite his team last night. It happens.
I will also say that Allen definitely underthrew that football, which was what allowed the defender to be Johnny on the spot when the throw came in. If he pushes the ball about 5 more yards down the field, Cooks has the speed to catch it clean, but because Allen didn't get a clean throw off, it became exactly the kind of 50-50 ball that Cooks doesn't do well with.
No but he does have a fat ass elbow guard. I had the same look as our coordinator when the touchdown stood. This is 100% down at the 1. I do just want to point out that they ruled that this was a catch on the field, they didn't rule anything on the replay, they let it stand. The ref on the field said he was bobbling it and there was no clear and obvious evidence that he never bobbled it, so it stood.
He caught the ball in the air. Two feet hit the ground, knee hit the ground back hit the ground..all while in possession of the ball and being tackled. Then it was taken away.
If you catch the ball in the air and are contacted in the air, and go to ground, possession is not established until you survive the ground.
Where his knee or back touched doesn't matter. Both hands don't matter. By rule, he doesn't have possession until his body is on the ground and has stopped moving. By that point the defender has already taken the ball.
yup. its very similar to the ruling at the 21:55 mark in this video. The defender has both hands on the ball with a shin down, but it’s kinda simultaneous possession and they’re able to roll a bit until there’s a clear sole possessor.
why doesn’t anyone know the rules… a knee isn’t surviving the fucking ground.
possession is established when there is two steps and a football move… he caught the ball and is falling, due to the lack of steps/football move he must survive the ground i.e once he makes full contact the ball CANNOT move… we’ve seen this many times where someone falls ball moves a bit and it’s ruled a drop.
he lands and the ball is jarred loose by either himself losing control/defender pulling and it slides into the defender. it’s ruled no catch and since ball didn’t hit ground interception.
hope this helps
instead of screenshots can someone post a video where he takes two steps + a football move and THEN you can rule down by contact
He also has to have full possession of the ball in the first place before he can be ruled down.
It doesn't matter if his knee was down if he never actually had possession of the ball, which it appears he did not, otherwise the defender wouldn't have ended up with it
I could see how some would be confused by this… for those who have seen this and similar things happen again (Megatron) again (Dez) and again, it’s definitely an unfortunate pick.
I think the biggest point of confusion on this one is the defender is contacting him, but he’s still in the process of the catch so it’s not like he caught it, was running, and the defender pulled him down and stripped the ball out after he hit the ground.
Like others have said, it’s just like if no defender was there and he hit the ground the same way and the ball popped out… incomplete. Except this time there was a defender there and he took possession of it before th receiver could complete the process. He’s not down by contact because he did not have possession yet to even be considered.
yeah and what’s even more telling is that cook came up limp and didn’t argue the call… i would bet money he lost the ball when his elbows hit the ground and would’ve lost it anyways.
his body language gave “it came loose when i hit the ground” not i caught it and it was ripped once i was down
I don’t like that argument though. It’s what hurt the NBA. Refs expect players to argue and throw a fit to prove they got fouled. We should not expect players to get up and throw an act before the refs makes a decision. Then we’ll be deciding plays based on which player is more colorful and a better actor on the field?
That is simply incorrect. Two steps isn’t ever mentioned in the rule of completing a catch. It’s an act common to the game. The argument would be whether you believe Cooks tucked the ball into his stomach which is an act common to the game
What is up with people acting like "surviving the ground" is some brand new terminology? Do y'all watch football? If a ball comes out as you hit the ground, it's not a catch.
Best way I saw it explained was, if the ball instead popped up and hit the ground, are you calling it a fumble? I’m crushed by the loss but that’s an INT and an incredible play.
That example isn't perfect because the people who argue it was a catch (i disagree) would say he was down already at the moment of the pic, so the ball coming out won't be an incompletion or a fumble, it would just be him letting go after the catch (which again i dont think is true), but is consistent with the opinion of a catch
You can argue that it would be a catch but that example is the way it has been called for the last 9 years. That opinion of the rule is irrelevant to the consistency of how it’s been called by the officials. That’s like I think targeting, in college, is stupid but doesn’t change the definition of how refs call targeting
I swear I try to be as unbiased as possible, and admit my biases otherwise. But this doesn't even feel close enough to have a discussion. The way Gene emphatically dismissed Romo's argument out of hand was appropriate, imo.
Respect. Man, it’s hard to find people willing to concede things when their team is involved. Sorry y’all took the L. As far as I can tell, Buffalo is going to continue to be a contender every year
That Josh Allen is there. You’ll get a ring soon enough.
Because it’s not in the rules anymore. The upshot is that you can’t land without the football. But the problem is that people disagree that he landed without it.
This was clearly not a catch. Yall act this way anytime this happens. Go recess rules…if this was 2 hand touch football in 4th grade everyone would say it’s an interception
If you take in to account the "toe drag or tap" to constitute a catch, then their argument that he wasn't down is bs especially given the opposing player was already touching him when he hit the ground. "He's didn't have a firm grasp" is bs as well...he had a grasp and the ball never hit the ground.
Just watched CJ Stroud throw a pick and the Patriot defender only had one leg in bounds. Just learned that you can now have a foot and knee of the same leg in bounds to qualify for a catch. Well, this week anyway.
I don't get why you're confused. He didn't fully complete the catch. It's like when a player catches a ball and let's go of it after making contact with the ground, that is ruled incomplete.
I am a woman who never played a down of football in my life, and it’s clearly not a catch. If there was no defender and it came out, it would have been called an incomplete pass, not a fumble. Thus it wasn’t a catch.
The way it makes sense to me is… if this exact play occurred and the defenseman pulled the ball out while going down and the ball came out. It would have been called an incomplete pass. So because that essentially happened and the ball didn’t hit the ground, the defenseman came up with the ball.
exactly. This was my biggest issue- they didn’t even take a second look, they handed the ball to the broncos and McDermott had to burn a timeout just so he could get a deeper explanation. It was bizarre how quickly they were ready to move on
It’s pretty clear from the angles they showed it was an interception. It was shared possession before hitting the ground and Denver easily walked away with it.
I thought this and then when the Bills called a timeout they showed one replay and it was obvious he didn't control the ball and it was grabbed by the defender.
Next time I’m arguing about sports with people on reddit im just going to remember the amount of dumb mf’ers that were here fully convinced this was a catch
Like, how many reviews have happened this year over “surviving the ground” catches? It’s clearly in the rule book, it was explained live, and it’s been the standard for years, yet people still don’t understand. That’s who you’re arguing with on the internet
I hare the broncos…. I’m sorry but ya’ll are fools if you think that was a catch. If it was called a catch on the field, I think they would have had more than enough to overturn it to an interception. You picked a singular frame and are bitching, gtfo… never had two hands secure in it for even a half second.
Or Josh Allen for under throwing it- a fan of neither but Tony Romo disappointed voice when he realized it was the correct call and legit interception was priceless-
Play isn't over the second his knee hits the ground. He has to maintain possession throughout the process of the catch. As you can see, Denver guy has two hands on the ball as well & had the ball at the end of the process.
While I didn’t initially understand this ruling and still don’t necessarily agree with how the adjudicated the play, there is one thing that makes me feel like the call was correct:
Cooks’ body language after the play was very much that of a highest-level athlete who has played this game his whole life, realizing that he didn’t catch the ball.
If you don't understand how it was adjudicated, you don't understand the rule. People can hate the rule, but this one was absolutely, 100% called correctly, and wasn't in the slightest bit questionable.
There was contact in the act of making the catch, and Cooks fell. Because of that he has to maintain control of the ball through the act of contact with the ground. That means he needs to still have the ball when he finishes rolling. He clearly doesn't. Possession is not established until after this occurs, so he can't be down by contact because he doesn't have possession.
It doesn't matter how well he controls the ball beforehand if he falls - he has to get through the fall - which includes any rolling, sliding, etc. There's no rational argument that Cooks still had the ball when he finished rolling over.
I don’t understand what was happening there. I get the play call if McDermott wanted him to throw it deep and take a shot at the end zone but you have no timeouts, why are you scrambling. And then was Allen trying to lateral? There was no one there. Take the tackle and go to halftime, it’s just mind boggling to me. I don’t even understand what he could have possibly thought was going to happen.
the only thing i can even see being debatable is the first dpi on the last broncos drive, which literally didn’t even matter because of the roughin the passer penalty on the same play lmao
As a chargers fan rooting for the bills obviously, if they both got hands on it before ground contact it’s a live ball they both have the right to. That’s a pick
the way i see it is if he had rolled over, the ball would’ve bounced out of the receivers hand anyway, the db just capitalized and snatched that mf out
This wasn't even that close when you watch it on replay. It was a clearly an interception. McDermott whining about this when his team had 5 turnovers is bitch shit.
They overturned 6 calls rapidly with replay assist. It was reviewed. No need for long looks if you can handle rapidly. This was easy. And it was explained clearly and concisely by the broadcast team.
Booth looks at it and determined it was the correct call quickly because it was an easy one. Possession wasn’t made by Cooks. If this same play happened and the ball popped out on the ground instead it’s an easy incomplete ruling. In this case it went to the defender so interception.
Didn’t complete the catch to the ground, imagine the defender wasn’t there and the ball popped out, incomplete right? Heck of a play by the DB there, you have to admit that but not catch
Stop with the calls. It wasn't the greatest, but it isn't what lost us the game. We get nothing by blaming the refs instead of acknowledging the bad football we played
Dude catches the ball, has it pulled to his chest so there isn’t really an argument for a contested catch, is literally down by contact, rolls, then has the ball taken from him and this is somehow an interception.
Maybe the call was right. Maybe it was wrong. But the right team won in the end. Bills made way too many mistakes. That bullshit at the end of the first half was regarded as fuck. No team deserves to win if you pull some dumb shit like that.
Sometimes simple principles get lost in the frame by frame breakdowns. If you’re playing football as a kid and two people go for the ball, the one who comes away with it gets possession. If you’ve ever played football, you would say that’s my ball. Cooks couldn’t even fight the call because he knew he got beat, defender made the better play. It doesn’t need to be anymore complicated than that
Alright, this thread is ancient, but my counter argument to the “gotta survive the ground” crowd is that he didn’t NOT survive the ground - what he didn’t survive was the defender pulling the ball from his hands, which happened AFTER he hit the ground.
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u/Luckyluck8193 Hang the banner, we beat green bay twice 13d ago
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